Dueling Agricola and Sylvestre Pg 166 (Ch 27) – the initial offence – Agricola offends Sylvestre Pg 225-232 (Ch 38) – Joe tricks (?) Agricola in to agreeing to “aid to liberate him from his danger, ‘right or wrong” (230) Pg232 (Ch 38) – Agricola signs an apology Rule 1.The first offense requires the first apology, though the retort may have been more offensive than the insult. Example: A tells B he is impertinent, etc. B retorts that he lies; yet A must make the first apology because he gave the first offense, and then (after one fire) B may explain away the retort by a subsequent apology. Pg 234 (Ch 39) – “You got to know de manner to make” – Manner over Matter (Creole style) Joe and Sylvestre Pg 240 – 242 (Ch 40) – “a small young man not unknown to us” (leaves the reader out) Pg 241 – Who gave the first offence?Can Joe even understand what they are saying? (they were speaking in Creole French) Rule 3.If a doubt exist who gave the first offense, the decision rests with the seconds (?); if they won't decide, or can't agree, the matter must proceed to two shots, or to a hit, if the challenger require it. Joseph Frowenfeld = The Reader? Pg 221 (Ch37) – Honoré (white) and Joe talking – “the theorizing” Reader can only do this, while the characters must do the actions. But, do we really have the “easy” part? We as readers have no control over what will come, but we can guess what will. Chapter 60 – “All Right”: Frowenfeld is now in love with Clotilde, and she is in love with him – he is now involved in the story, not just an outsider. Is he us (the reader) at this point? Have we finally been invited in at the end of the novel? Pg 225-232 (Ch 38) – Joe tricks (?) Agricola in to agreeing to “aid to liberate him from his danger, ‘right or wrong” (230) -Does he have status to do this? According to the “code”, can he intervene like this? -What is he trying to accomplish in doing this? Does he really want to save lives, or is he trying to break Agricola of the code? Is he trying to overcome the code? Is he still “the reader” at this point? STEPHENS – “The reader identifies with Frowenfeld’s level of knowledge rather than with Honoré’s… The comedy is essentially a record of Frowenfeld’s discoveries in the long lawsuit of opinions and proofs” Pg 513 -He gathers information from everyone in the town, just like a reader would (Pg 514) -Learning the story of Bras Coupe is most important – he works out the puzzle of relationships (learns why certain characters hate others) Past to guide the Present -Challenges the code – but can readers really do this? Crack the egg, not smash it!! The Dilemma of Family/Righteous Pg 247 (Ch 41) – Honoré (white) showing the reader his dilemma – save his family’s land or do what is right by Aurora and Clotilde, giving them what is rightfully theirs. Keep the wealth in his family or give it to its rightful owner. Pg 260 (Ch 43) – Aurora saying “people ought to have their rights” – her humility convinces him that he needs to do the right thing What are Honoré’s (white) feelings towards his family? He took his colored brother into business with him, so he obviously is not concerned with the idea of keeping everything pure blooded, like Agricola is. Is it truly a battle of old vs. new? Old vs. New Pg 324 (Ch 58) – The aged high priest of a doomed civilization (Agricola's death) The Creole way of life being personified in Agricola? Stabbed by a “colored” man and killed? The Creole lifestyle trying to hang on, but to no avail? It is being taken away from them in government and in their community. Pg 330 (Ch 59) – The Creole character had been "diluted and sweetened" (death of Agricola), but by what? STEPHENS – Pg 508 – ‘Kulturroman’= A novel depicting the clash of two cultures - Critics used this word to describe The Grandissimes STEPHENS - Pg 509 - Cable wanted to depict the “Creole errors and defects and how to mend them… but do in a moral sense” Pg 517-18 – That Frowenfeld “has succeeded in cracking the egg becomes increasingly clear as more and more Creoles give up their ritual bondage to Agricola’s arbitrary code” Pg 518 – “Agricola’s call for Louisiana (on his death bed) echoes Bras Coupe’s dying invocation of Africa; both still look to old worlds as their homes and are unable to think of themselves as citizens of the new world in America.”
Last Three Chapters Pg 330 (Ch 59) – Two people (35-38 years old, ‘very elegant-looking people’) go to France, Brother and sister (?), gives her a last will and testament directed to M. Honoré Grandissime and is nervous, then Honoré f.m.c. found dead. She lives in France ‘in the rue ----.” -What does it mean? Pg 332 (Ch 60) – Joe and Clotilde, Honoré and Aurora out walking, Dr sees them and is jealous, things are “all right” until….. Pg 336 (Ch 61) – Aurora refuses Honoré!...? What does it mean? -Is Aurora just being Aurora - a silly woman who always laughs and jokes? -Is it a commentary on Creole life? Tensions between Creole and American life? -Is it supposed to have an unhappy ending, just like the Creole way of life dies, so does the love affair? -Did Cable not want his lovers to have a happy ending? Why? -Does everything have to be so confusing with the Creole way of life? Manner over matter? The manner of the novel is more important than the outcome?
Cable’s The Grandissimes and the Comedy of Manners by Robert O. Stephens Comedy of manners = a plot that satirizes manners of a social class. The plot of love is usually less important than witty dialogue and the manner of the people (correct this if I am wrong!) Pg 509 – Cable admits that the ‘plot was not laboriously planned’ -This helps us understand the confusing ending? -Emphasis was on ‘the Creole world, not the clash between Creole and American civilizations. His purpose was to depict “Creole errors and defects and how to mend them,” all within the context of a love story based on the “very old and familiar plot of a feud between two families…” Pg 510 - “The masked is never wholly absent from the action” – The audience is sometimes masked from what is really going on, names, situations… until a later time -“A comedy of manners: establishment of the code of a limited and closed society, challenge of that code by an outsider or a renegade insider or both, and a resolution either rejecting the challenger and reaffirming the code or showing the challenger successful and the code altered” The challenger in this case not necessarily being Frowenfeld or Honoré but also America.
Agricola and Sylvestre
Pg 166 (Ch 27) – the initial offence – Agricola offends Sylvestre
Pg 225-232 (Ch 38) – Joe tricks (?) Agricola in to agreeing to “aid to liberate him from his danger, ‘right or wrong” (230)
Pg 232 (Ch 38) – Agricola signs an apology
Rule 1. The first offense requires the first apology, though the retort may have been more offensive than the insult. Example: A tells B he is impertinent, etc. B retorts that he lies; yet A must make the first apology because he gave the first offense, and then (after one fire) B may explain away the retort by a subsequent apology.
Pg 234 (Ch 39) – “You got to know de manner to make” – Manner over Matter (Creole style)
Joe and Sylvestre
Pg 240 – 242 (Ch 40) – “a small young man not unknown to us” (leaves the reader out)
Pg 241 – Who gave the first offence? Can Joe even understand what they are saying? (they were speaking in Creole French)
Rule 3. If a doubt exist who gave the first offense, the decision rests with the seconds (?); if they won't decide, or can't agree, the matter must proceed to two shots, or to a hit, if the challenger require it.
Joseph Frowenfeld = The Reader?
Pg 221 (Ch37) – Honoré (white) and Joe talking – “the theorizing”
Reader can only do this, while the characters must do the actions. But, do we really have the “easy” part? We as readers have no control over what will come, but we can guess what will.
Chapter 60 – “All Right”: Frowenfeld is now in love with Clotilde, and she is in love with him – he is now involved in the story, not just an outsider. Is he us (the reader) at this point? Have we finally been invited in at the end of the novel?
Pg 225-232 (Ch 38) – Joe tricks (?) Agricola in to agreeing to “aid to liberate him from his danger, ‘right or wrong” (230)
- Does he have status to do this? According to the “code”, can he intervene like this?
- What is he trying to accomplish in doing this? Does he really want to save lives, or is he trying to break Agricola of the code? Is he trying to overcome the code? Is he still “the reader” at this point?
STEPHENS – “The reader identifies with Frowenfeld’s level of knowledge rather than with Honoré’s… The comedy is essentially a record of Frowenfeld’s discoveries in the long lawsuit of opinions and proofs” Pg 513
- He gathers information from everyone in the town, just like a reader would (Pg 514)
- Learning the story of Bras Coupe is most important – he works out the puzzle of relationships (learns why certain characters hate others) Past to guide the Present
- Challenges the code – but can readers really do this? Crack the egg, not smash it!!
The Dilemma of Family/Righteous
Pg 247 (Ch 41) – Honoré (white) showing the reader his dilemma – save his family’s land or do what is right by Aurora and Clotilde, giving them what is rightfully theirs. Keep the wealth in his family or give it to its rightful owner.
Pg 260 (Ch 43) – Aurora saying “people ought to have their rights” – her humility convinces him that he needs to do the right thing
What are Honoré’s (white) feelings towards his family? He took his colored brother into business with him, so he obviously is not concerned with the idea of keeping everything pure blooded, like Agricola is. Is it truly a battle of old vs. new?
Old vs. New
Pg 324 (Ch 58) – The aged high priest of a doomed civilization (Agricola's death)
The Creole way of life being personified in Agricola? Stabbed by a “colored” man and killed? The Creole lifestyle trying to hang on, but to no avail? It is being taken away from them in government and in their community.
Pg 330 (Ch 59) – The Creole character had been "diluted and sweetened" (death of Agricola), but by what?
STEPHENS – Pg 508 – ‘Kulturroman’= A novel depicting the clash of two cultures
- Critics used this word to describe The Grandissimes
STEPHENS - Pg 509 - Cable wanted to depict the “Creole errors and defects and how to mend them… but do in a moral sense”
Pg 517-18 – That Frowenfeld “has succeeded in cracking the egg becomes increasingly clear as more and more Creoles give up their ritual bondage to Agricola’s arbitrary code”
Pg 518 – “Agricola’s call for Louisiana (on his death bed) echoes Bras Coupe’s dying invocation of Africa; both still look to old worlds as their homes and are unable to think of themselves as citizens of the new world in America.”
Last Three Chapters
Pg 330 (Ch 59) – Two people (35-38 years old, ‘very elegant-looking people’) go to France, Brother and sister (?), gives her a last will and testament directed to M. Honoré Grandissime and is nervous, then Honoré f.m.c. found dead. She lives in France ‘in the rue ----.”
-What does it mean?
Pg 332 (Ch 60) – Joe and Clotilde, Honoré and Aurora out walking, Dr sees them and is jealous, things are “all right” until…..
Pg 336 (Ch 61) – Aurora refuses Honoré!...? What does it mean?
- Is Aurora just being Aurora - a silly woman who always laughs and jokes?
- Is it a commentary on Creole life? Tensions between Creole and American life?
- Is it supposed to have an unhappy ending, just like the Creole way of life dies, so does the love affair?
- Did Cable not want his lovers to have a happy ending? Why?
- Does everything have to be so confusing with the Creole way of life? Manner over matter? The manner of the novel is more important than the outcome?
Cable’s The Grandissimes and the Comedy of Manners by Robert O. Stephens
Comedy of manners = a plot that satirizes manners of a social class. The plot of love is usually less important than witty dialogue and the manner of the people (correct this if I am wrong!)
Pg 509 – Cable admits that the ‘plot was not laboriously planned’
- This helps us understand the confusing ending?
- Emphasis was on ‘the Creole world, not the clash between Creole and American civilizations. His purpose was to depict “Creole errors and defects and how to mend them,” all within the context of a love story based on the “very old and familiar plot of a feud between two families…”
Pg 510 - “The masked is never wholly absent from the action”
– The audience is sometimes masked from what is really going on, names, situations… until a later time
- “A comedy of manners: establishment of the code of a limited and closed society, challenge of that code by an outsider or a renegade insider or both, and a resolution either rejecting the challenger and reaffirming the code or showing the challenger successful and the code altered” The challenger in this case not necessarily being Frowenfeld or Honoré but also America.